Gun control thread #4387
- Thread starter Loxley
- Start date
@Loxley; Well, that's to be expected. It'll make the politicians look good, and people that have no interest in firearms will also be happy due to it being harder to get equipment for these things.
Sweden is supposed to revise their gunlaws aswell after some shootings in Malmö earlier.
Sweden is supposed to revise their gunlaws aswell after some shootings in Malmö earlier.
Ilosar
Vault Fossil
Yeah, a guy killing 70 people with legal assault rifles doesn't warrant a revision of gun laws. Clearly. Norway is the very first country is history to react harshly to a terrorist attack, after all.
They are going to revise the type of weapons available. So basically they most likely going to ban semi automatics. Dunno if this is rifles only.
Biggest issue is that they gonna take licences away from people that have been inactive for a while. Bit stupid I think since the gunner was active, while it will make getting back into hunting tougher than before for those that want to hunt.
Biggest issue is that they gonna take licences away from people that have been inactive for a while. Bit stupid I think since the gunner was active, while it will make getting back into hunting tougher than before for those that want to hunt.
And now the fucking commies that said "We won't let this attack change our way of life. We will remain the most free country in the world." are now going to enforce weapon laws that put the UK to shame...
For FUCK SAKE people. When will you fucking learn not to have a kneejerk reaction and that your freedome ends where someone else's begins.
Norway had a clear record when coming to gun crime with legal guns. One nutjob that also stated "If I couldn't get legal guns, I'd have gotten an illegal AK and GRENADES" goes on a rampage and BAM, everyone pays for it because the damn commies are pushing their own agenda on the back of 77 dead people.
CLASSY. Very classy.
For FUCK SAKE people. When will you fucking learn not to have a kneejerk reaction and that your freedome ends where someone else's begins.
Norway had a clear record when coming to gun crime with legal guns. One nutjob that also stated "If I couldn't get legal guns, I'd have gotten an illegal AK and GRENADES" goes on a rampage and BAM, everyone pays for it because the damn commies are pushing their own agenda on the back of 77 dead people.
CLASSY. Very classy.
Surf Solar
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
SuAside said:
Wintermind
Vault Senior Citizen
I with SuAside on the stupid thing to do. Dunno about the commies and all that, but fucking over a bunch of law abiding citizens because of one lone nut is just dumb.
I mean if norway thinks that assault rifles should eventually be not in the hands of civilians ... its their decision no ?
To have limitations with some weapons does not mean it will be impossible to have firearms. It just means you have to deal with some restrictions.
Just like many other things.
Otherwise. if you come up freedom. Then I want have access to nuclear weapons. It cuts my freedom and my rights to bear powerfull nuclear weapons.
To have limitations with some weapons does not mean it will be impossible to have firearms. It just means you have to deal with some restrictions.
Just like many other things.
Otherwise. if you come up freedom. Then I want have access to nuclear weapons. It cuts my freedom and my rights to bear powerfull nuclear weapons.
Ilosar
Vault Fossil
Imagine the public outrage if he was declared insane. Few years in an asylum, and out goes the mass-murderer. No way. This guy is fully aware of his acts, he must rot in jail for the rest of his life. Hell, officially he is a terrorist, ship him to Guantanamo, if anybody deserves it it's him*
I always found a bit weird weird people equate the right to wield assault rifles with freedom or security. I mean, if you need to defend yourself, surely a pistol would do, no? Otherwise, if you really need an assault rifle or assorted automatic weapon, you probably pissed off somebody whom you should not have, like the mafia or something. And even here in super-anti-guns Canada you can have a pistol at home, provide it's registered ect.
But anyway, the liberal use of the term ''commie'' to describe any left-leaning person already left your argument null and void.
* I know Guantanamo has no business with him.
I always found a bit weird weird people equate the right to wield assault rifles with freedom or security. I mean, if you need to defend yourself, surely a pistol would do, no? Otherwise, if you really need an assault rifle or assorted automatic weapon, you probably pissed off somebody whom you should not have, like the mafia or something. And even here in super-anti-guns Canada you can have a pistol at home, provide it's registered ect.
But anyway, the liberal use of the term ''commie'' to describe any left-leaning person already left your argument null and void.
* I know Guantanamo has no business with him.
James Snowscoran
Still Mildly Glowing
There's quite a bit of firearms in civilian hands in Norway (5x as many per capita as in England IIRC) but they're not meant to be used for self-defense, only for competitive shooting and hunting. Gun laws will probably come up for review here, and there might come some new restrictions on semi-automatic handguns and pistols, but noone's been trying to blame the incident on lax gun control or use it to leverage an agenda of new gun laws. Unlike the US, our gun laws are pretty much consensus-based and have been fairly uncontroversial.
the guns are not the cause to the crime anyway. They are just a tool used in the incident. And chance is high even with very harsh laws he might have found one way or another to get weapons.
What I find interesting though is how people with all seriousness want to actually explain now that some fully automatic assault rifle or machine gun is exactly the same like a for example a 9mm handgun.
And yeah. A firecracker is sure the same like a grenade.
What I find interesting though is how people with all seriousness want to actually explain now that some fully automatic assault rifle or machine gun is exactly the same like a for example a 9mm handgun.
And yeah. A firecracker is sure the same like a grenade.
Wintermind
Vault Senior Citizen
Gunlaws are almost universally failures because they only hurt people who obey the law. Criminals give no fucks and are going to buy those things anyway from the thriving black market the governments created by outlawing all those guns.
I feel sorry all the folks in other countries don't have their rights to own firearms guaranteed by something like our Bill Of Rights. Even though we have some goddamned stupid laws, still.
Also, there are sporting organizations and events that use just about every type of modern firearm. In America atleast. I don't know if IDPA or anything is particularly popular else where.
I feel sorry all the folks in other countries don't have their rights to own firearms guaranteed by something like our Bill Of Rights. Even though we have some goddamned stupid laws, still.
Also, there are sporting organizations and events that use just about every type of modern firearm. In America atleast. I don't know if IDPA or anything is particularly popular else where.
Wintermind said:
Though the same could be said about any law. I know where you are coming from but that is still somewhat a fallacy.
Just because there is a black market for drugs and other illegal things does not mean we have to dump all laws now because it only hurts the people who "obey" the law.
Laws give the government the chance to fight crime. What ever if we now think those laws are right or not. But some nations chose to have limitations for weapons for what ever reason.
I remember a case here in Germany where the police found 2 G36 assault rifles in the car of two teenagers in a random inspection. Who knows why they had those assault rifles. Or what they might have done with it in the end.
The really interesting part is though that from what I know this guy in Norway bought tons of fertilizer which contained chemicals for a bomb. Regardless that the vendor reported him to the authorities (I think he had to) they did nothing to check the case. Regardless that he probably didn't need so much of fertilizer. It is one thing if you have laws another one if you use them. Though if I remember correctly even in the US if a usual person is buying so much fertilizer with rather questionable chemicals they will be checked by certain authorities. Why that ? isn't that cutting your freedom to buy "fertilizer" when ever you want ? And even if you want to get a bomb. Why are you not allowed to own one or build one ? isn't that as well cutting your freedom ? Thing is sometimes what ever if we like it or not we have to deal with certain limitations. That is how ANY government works. It does not help always to prevent every situation. But it would be worse to do nothing at all just because it is impossible to get everyone.
The harsh reality though is regardless how good or harsh laws are we probably will always face situations like those in norway. As long we cant read the mind of people we will never be sure who is nuts and who not.
James Snowscoran
Still Mildly Glowing
He established some agriculture company as a front. A vegetable grower buying fertilizer isn't enough to make any alarm bells ring anywhere.
It's a throwaway insult. If that's the only thing you took from my post, I pity you.Surf Solar said:SuAside said:
At the same time it's also a reference to those who have indeed outlawed guns in the past in the name of public safety and then wholesale slaughtered a few tens of millions of people for good measure. Surely, this will not happen in Norway, but it's ridiculous to believe that outlawing guns has anything to do with public safety at all.
Who even said ANYTHING about assault rifles? A semi-automatic rifle is never an assault rifle.Ilosar said:
Not to mention semi-automatic hunting rifles are far more dangerous than your supposed "evil black rifle" that just happens to shoot the same ammo as the military does.
I currently own 9 firearms. None of them I own for personal protection. Security does not even need to come into it at all.
BTW, I find it hilarious that you say that you basically can't rightly protect yourself from organizations like the maffia.
Also, you mention pistols? Hehe, well, they're on the "to be banned shortly" list as well, if the socialist party has their way in Norway. Only bolt action or pump action is to be allowed.
Either way, Norway already had fairly strict gun laws. These type of things do not prevent maniacs and/or motivated people from slaughtering people wholesale.
Not to mention that forfeiting people's legally owned property is extremely unjust. (yes, the previously enacted ban on certain weapons in Norway meant that you had to turn in your weapons without any compensation whatsoever)
I'm part of the Flemish Liberal & Democrat party. How about them apples?Ilosar said:
How can you quantify what I "should" own or not? And who are you to say what I should have or not? Millions of people around the world own guns legally for various reasons. A tiny margin of them ends up abusing them.Sabirah said:
How about we take your own reasoning to kitchen knives, cars, or fire axes and medicines? Guns and knives are tools... Stop limiting my freedom when I do not threathen yours.
Do you by the way realize that a good 12 Gauge slug is far more dangerous than anything I currently own? There are very few types of military body armor that can stop one piercing slug, let alone multiple hits.
Aside from the commie thing, it's very serious.Loxley said:
Gun laws generally work best when in an intermediate form. It's the extremes that rarely seem to have any good effects. Total or extremely restrictive ban seems to yield similar long term results as total freedom to own firearms.Wintermind said:
There are many types of intermediate gun laws that have shown success. Hell, Norway never had any issues with legally owned guns. The random nutjob taking abuse of the system cannot be prevented any more than you can prevent a drunk driver with a license from running over a child with his car. Sadly, the latter happens a lot more than the former.
People often forget that the MAJORITY of people in the rural areas on the european mainland carried firearms in the period between the world wars. There were plagues of wild dogs that would attack people walking past or driving past on bicycles. The "Velodog" revolvers were everywhere. Yet there was hardly any more gun crime than there is now. Hell, even less if statistics are to be believed.
As for IDPA and IPSC, yes, the sport is also pretty popular in Europe.
That's a weird thing to say. The people decide upon the laws, and we can change them.Crni Vuk said:
So you'd be fine with 1984?Crni Vuk said:
There is absolutely no line that the government can cross where you'd say: "THIS IS ENOUGH, I WANT MY FREEDOM"?
James Snowscoran
Still Mildly Glowing
Yeah, no, you're basically talking out of your ass. The people who have been vocal about wanting further restrictions here is the police, not any particular political party. But hey, let's just assume them darn commies are cooking up some new scheme to screw us over, right?SuAside said:
Also bull, all that's needed for a shotgun or semi-automatic rifle is a weekend safety course and a secure storage cabinet.SuAside said:
I guess it's a good thing you live in Belgium where you don't HAVE a functioning government, at least that way you don't have to live in constant paranoid terror of waking up in air strip one.SuAside said: