Question about Project Brazil

[Ragemage]

Since this is a New Vegas mod, I put it in the New Vegas Discussion forum. Sorry if this is the wrong place for it!

Anyway, I have a very simple question: Is this mod lorebreaking? I know it's basically meant to be a seperate game from FO:NV but it still touts itself as a Fallout game/DLC/expansion/whatever.

I don't like getting mods that break lore, at all. The closest I've come is New Vegas Bounties, but even then that mod tries to stick pretty close to the lore outside of a couple hiccups. Most of the lore-breaking stuff is relegated to the Wild Wasteland perk and will only appear if you have it, so that's fine with me.

So yeah, I haven't played it, but it looks interesting. I haven't really tried any quest-heavy mods for NV until New Vegas Bounties, but I loved NVB so much I want more quest mods, and PB looks neat. I also want to try Beyond Boulder Dome because it expands upon a big plot point thing that was going to be in Van Buren, and there's a lot of untapped potential in Van Buren. Makes me happy to see someone finally use it.

 

[Practicat]

Whether it was lore breaking hardly matters now, if at all, because the developers of PB will be releasing the final version which is drastically different from the first version that pales in comparison.

You can even follow their progress on their design document: https://docs.google.com/document/d/...y2ljlRtB7TYKPcgcB37vY8/edit?disco=AAAAAEZ3bRE

 

[DirtyOldShoe]

I don't like getting mods that break lore.

All mods break lore, deal with it.

 

[Ragemage]

All mods break lore, deal with it.

Not really, no. There's plenty of mods that follow the lore or add on to existing parts of the lore, such as content from Van Buren that wasn't used. There's plenty like that, I have a lot of them.

 

[Ragemage]

Whether it was lore breaking hardly matters now, if at all, because the developers of PB will be releasing the final version which is drastically different from the first version that pales in comparison.

You can even follow their progress on their design document: https://docs.google.com/document/d/...y2ljlRtB7TYKPcgcB37vY8/edit?disco=AAAAAEZ3bRE

Hm, interesting. So you're saying that basically I should just wait until the final version comes out?

 

[DirtyOldShoe]

Not really, no.

List some, I'll prove you wrong. Just because something says Van Buren doesn't mean anything.

 

[Practicat]

Hm, interesting. So you're saying that basically I should just wait until the final version comes out?

Yeah, you should. Even the PC's background has been totally changed from what it was in the initial release. All the original environments have been redone. This could even be a stronger RPG than even New Vegas, 1, or 2, just from what I've seen from the quest flowcharts.

 

[Ninja]

This could even be a stronger RPG than even New Vegas, 1, or 2

Yeah, and I could inherit millions of dollars from a deceased African prince.

 

[Ragemage]

List some, I'll prove you wrong. Just because something says Van Buren doesn't mean anything.

New Vegas Bounties doesn't break the lore outside of 1 single character, and that was just to juice up the plot so I can forgive it. It doesn't even really break the lore that hard, it just follows Bethesda's lore involving ghouls being able to form immediately from a large dose of radiation.

Beyond Boulder Dome doesn't break the lore since it's pretty much based entirely off events from Van Buren. Outside of cats being in it, but that was retconned anyway so it's fine.

Bison Steve Hotel Restored doesn't break the lore because it's clearly established the place was a hotel during the events of the game before the Powder Gangers strolled into town. No reason that after the events of Primm's take over, them getting a new sheriff, and the casino coming back to life, that the Bison Steve shouldn't also start getting populated once again.

Simple Slavery makes sense because we know the Legion trades with Slavers in the Mojave, such as the one who captured Boone's wife. So why shouldn't we be able to become a slaver and trade with the Legion? Makes sense to me, and it gives some much needed content to Legion supporters.

Those are the only really big mods I have. The rest just restore cut content or pretty up the game graphics-wise. I guess really what I mean is, I don't care if they have to bend the rules a teensy bit, but mods that just straight out shove a large schlong into the lore are the ones I have issues with. Still, it's rather silly to assume that just because it's a mod it breaks the lore.

 

[Practicat]

At least from a C&C perspective, it could be stronger than the past games. Have a look for yourself at the design document.

 

[Ninja]

At least from a C&C perspective, it could be stronger than the past games. Have a look for yourself at the design document.

Oh wait, I thought you were talking about that Frontier mod. My bad. I should pay more attention to the thread title.

Yeah, PB is going to be awesome. I'm really looking forward to the release of the second installment.

 

[DirtyOldShoe]

Definition: "traditional knowledge or belief ."

New Vegas Bounties doesn't break the lore outside of 1 single character, and that was just to juice up the plot so I can forgive it.

Bounties 1, Great mod, however Steven Randell is not in established lore, nor is Randell and associates, Judge, Freddy, Ricky, Thomas, Eileen, etc etc. Direct references to popular film. Tuco.

Bounties 2, Great mod, however, Larry Skull and the Boulder City Jail are not in lore, There is no jail on the side of the road or a building that was dilapidated in said spot. Spaghetti Western References such as Sergio, Marko and many others are not mentioned in lore. Most bounties are a play on some real world event or person, but none of them were ever mentioned in lore.

Bounties 3, Great mod, Same answer as Bounties 2, The depiction of the land in the new world space, the state of the factions and their depiction. The story that you go on leads you to the ending scene recreated from "The Good, the Bad and the Ugly." That is not in lore anywhere that I am aware of.

Beyond Boulder Dome doesn't break the lore since it's pretty much based entirely off events from Van Buren.

Please direct me to a lore article that supports the suspicion that Conny may or may not be a gremlin? Or the ever so popular Death Squad Troopers, mating grunts of female chimpanzees' holotape. etc etc.

Bison Steve Hotel Restored doesn't break the lore.

So, why doesn't Ruby and Johnson Nash or the deputy have any knowledge of Steve, It's almost like he wasn't written into lore. Based on your logic, if I made a mod that restored the top floor of the Mojave Express it would be lore friendly. But it wouldn't because it is not mentioned in lore that that ever took place. Steve is a fan creation, just like all the others. It might be fun and immersive, but it is not lore-friendly.

The rest just restore cut content.

Content that was cut was not added to lore as it is not part of the game. Cook-Cook in lore was not a guy that the Courier could talk to, so restoring the lines are not lore friendly as it did not take place in lore.

pretty up the game graphics-wise.

Models and textures can not be lore friendly unless it is a replacement for new items, but those items would have had to have been included. Retexturing a house can not be lore friendly because lore does not archive textures or palettes, retexturing the sign for Prospectors Saloon would not be subject to lore, but replacing it with a giant dildo would.

I do use all of those mods, I have endorsed them and I think the authors did a terrific job, but they are not lore friendly and if you think they are then you are confused by the word lore. Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

 

[Ragemage]

snip

The whole thing about the New Vegas Bounties series is that it adds some new lore. As long as this new lore fits within the confines of the established lore, I see no problems with it.

The thing is, Johnson Nash DOES mention the previous owner of the Steve Bison Hotel. He tells you it was a woman who ended up moving out. The mod basically brings in this woman's grandson who wants to restore the place. Simple as that.

I can't answer questions regarding Boulder Dome because I haven't finished it myself.

Noticed you didn't comment on the Simple Slavery mod.

What I mean is, with Project Brazil and all of the above, I'm perfectly fine with a mod adding new lore, so long as that lore doesn't retcon or break something already established. For example of lore breaking, how in Fallout 4 the BOS has a massive army of Vertibirds despite the fact that Vertibirds run strictly off gasoline, we are never told they don't run off gasoline, etc etc which just completely rapes the lore. But if someone wants to, say, make a mod that adds some sort of new mercenary group, as long as they don't undermine already existing groups or break lore with already existing groups, I have no issues with it. None of these mods break already existing lore, they simply add on to it. I don't see how this "breaks the lore" if it's only adding on to said lore.

 

[DirtyOldShoe]

None of these mods break already existing lore, they simply add on to it. I don't see how this "breaks the lore" if it's only adding on to said lore.

Sorry, I get set off at the term lore-friendly. Lore rape and lore break I totally get.
I admit when I am wrong and I was wrong, too much rage from a dirty old shoe.
Sorry Ragemage.

 

[Ragemage]

Sorry, I get set off at the term lore-friendly. Lore rape and lore break I totally get.
I admit when I am wrong and I was wrong, too much rage from a dirty old shoe.
Sorry Ragemage.

Apology accepted. I guess to you lore means exactly what's in the game and nothing else huh? Honestly I consider cut content to be part of the game even if it has to be modded in considering the fact New Vegas is an unfinished game thanks to Bethesda's super tight schedule. Pretty much all the cut content was going to be added at some point, it just had to be scrapped to save time. I wish honestly that we had gotten a Broken Steel type DLC for New Vegas that added a lot of cut content back in, or one that added in a lot of the planned Legion content.

 

[Atomic Postman]

Any mod that adds content not originally created by the developers (i.e not cut content) is non-canon and thus lore unfriendly. Even then, cut content is a bit dicey.

 

[Spacemunkey]

I don't know how lore friendly really any mod is, but seeing as it's only canon to your particular game and not the series as a whole, I hope you don't let that stop you from enjoying some quality mods by some quality mod authors.

 

[Dr Fallout]

I don't know how lore friendly really any mod is, but seeing as it's only canon to your particular game and not the series as a whole, I hope you don't let that stop you from enjoying some quality mods by some quality mod authors.

Agreed. I find mods that add new lore that doesn't contradict other lore and fits in MY eyes is lore friendly enough.

 

[Vergil]

All mods break lore, deal with it.

Lore breaking =/= adding something that isn't established. As long as it doesn't directly contradict current lore it's not lore breaking. It may be non canon but the existence of a bounty hunting service or places like Frosthill are never said to be impossible, thus, they don't break the lore. A mod that replaced all of Caesar's Legion with Master Chief from Halo would be however.

 

[DirtyOldShoe]

Lore breaking =/= adding something that isn't established. As long as it doesn't directly contradict current lore it's not lore breaking. It may be non canon but the existence of a bounty hunting service or places like Frosthill are never said to be impossible, thus, they don't break the lore. A mod that replaced all of Caesar's Legion with Master Chief from Halo would be however.

Sorry, I get set off at the term lore-friendly. Lore rape and lore break I totally get.
I admit when I am wrong and I was wrong, too much rage from a dirty old shoe.
Sorry Ragemage.